The new team at Vera seems to have set out on quite a project to overhaul the system. Without a LOT of new unit sales, I’m not so sure they can finance all this. Shall we expect a monthly fee based system going forward? Will we have to pay for each major f/w release or then only be able to stick to the one we’re on?
Questions I have that seem unanswered in all the fanfare.
The real cost of these systems is the software, not the hardware. I have always advocated for Mios to charge for software upgrades and maintenance. Aside from Apple, which is able to charge obscene money for their hardware, most companies charge for ongoing software support.
The exact reason I bought a VeraPlus to begin with is the lack of monthly fees but I don’t see how that is sustainable going forward.
I will not pay a monthly fee.
Jim
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
The main reason I am with Vera is because there is NO monthly fees associated. If you are planning on service based fees, then what is the difference between Vera and other contract security systems? For sure, I will quit Vera if it is going on service fee based.
I choose Vera for the no cloud dependency and the no monthly fee. Those were my biggest reasons also.
The reason I chose Vera b/c it was a pay once model.
Before we moved, I was running Vera and OpenHab side by side but never had the time to finish my OpenHab configuration for the wife acceptance factor.
If they start charging for updates or monthly service fees. I will have to look elsewhere again.
This is really not true. You are advocating for a different business model which works for some companies but not others and in this case would be a go out of business fast model. The software upgrade and maintenance is already completely built into the price of the unit. Aside from B2B software businesses like office365 and the alikes, nobody is being really successful with this model. The vera is a piece of hardware with very poor software management. It has little to do with resources, more about intelligent planning and management. You only need 2 good guys part time to develop a UI and a lua based engine like ALTUI/openLuup. Unless the new MIOS wants to be a hardware agnostic company and just sell software (like zwave.me) this isn’t going to work. If the firmware would be well built to begin with in would not need upgrades and maintenance and even less resources. The resources if any should be spent on new developments.
SaaS companies (software as a service) are one of the larger growth segments in the market right now. I am with you and most here, and I am not eager to pay monthly for vera, but to say SaaS has really not worked is a huge inaccuracy.
[quote=“Sammy2, post:1, topic:199684”]The new team at Vera seems to have set out on quite a project to overhaul the system. Without a LOT of new unit sales, I’m not so sure they can finance all this. Shall we expect a monthly fee based system going forward? Will we have to pay for each major f/w release or then only be able to stick to the one we’re on?
Questions I have that seem unanswered in all the fanfare.[/quote]
Everything has a cost of ownership!
You can either pay $200 upfront for hardware or pay $few dollars a month…can i give hardware, software, cloud services for free…No…Can I reduce your overall cost…Yes!
As to what models…first of all, happy for you to pay me upfront all these monies (whatever you are paying now)…but i think its not a good model…
here is what i want…
Reduce the cost of hardware…
Create a proper platform for developers so that they can write proper applications and services (not just integration with devices we should have integrated out of box!!!) and push that in our appstore…
This way, we get a continuous revenue stream, You the user get access to very cheap home automation and use it for free and only pay if you use a service that you think is valuable to you, therefore creating an ecosystem for developers as well.
Is it a short term business model. No.
Are we committed to make this happen, you bet your bottom dollar!
We are working on such an exciting projects with ecosystem creating all sort of new applications/services that has huge value to end users, it will unlock the next stage of automation…We are here to catch the next wave…
SaaS companies (software as a service) are one of the larger growth segments in the market right now. I am with you and most here, and I am not eager to pay monthly for vera, but to say SaaS has really not worked is a huge inaccuracy.[/quote]
Yes it is a huge growth area in the corporate world. No so much in the consumer market is my point.
Everything has a cost of ownership! You can either pay $200 upfront for hardware or pay $few dollars a month....can i give hardware, software, cloud services for free...No...Can I reduce your overall cost..Yes! As to what models..first of all, happy for you to pay me upfront all these monies (whatever you are paying now)....but i think its not a good model.... here is what i want... Reduce the cost of hardware.... Create a proper platform for developers so that they can write proper applications and services (not just integration with devices we should have integrated out of box!!!) and push that in our appstore....This way, we get a continuous revenue stream, You the user get access to very cheap home automation and use it for free and only pay if you use a service that you think is valuable to you, therefore creating an ecosystem for developers as well.
Is it a short term business model. No.
Are we committed to make this happen, you bet your bottom dollar!We are working on such an exciting projects with ecosystem creating all sort of new applications/services that has huge value to end users, it will unlock the next stage of automation…We are here to catch the next wave…
If this is the direction we are going then I will be out !!! I rather pay the upfront cost and not have to worry about monthly fees. And I don’t want to be nickel and dimed for software apps that should be part of the core anyway. And i don’t want the headaches (stress) of trying to decide who’s app is the right app for what it is I am trying to do. I want a set and forget it, until I decide to change something, then set it and forget it again.
I absolutely expect firmware updates to products I buy for free !!! Almost everything in my house is updated that way: Sony TV, Soundbar, Playstation, Xbox, Pentair Pool module, Sunny Boy Solar web module, iPhone, iPad, Foscam cameras, … I don’t even think I could list everything that has free updates.
You will have to provide examples of what is a “service” that I will be willing to pay for above what the product (Vera) should be doing for me already.
I have a bad feeling about this…
I don’t mind a monthly/annual fee for software upgrades and the cloud based service like encrypted remote controls/notifications/alexa/GHome/ifttt/etc.
However I won’t use a product that only works if I pay a recurring fee. I saw people burned when the revolve hub turned into a paperweight when nest shut the servers down. It needs to work in local mode regardless of mios servers/account status.
[quote=“randya, post:12, topic:199684”]
Everything has a cost of ownership!
You can either pay $200 upfront for hardware or pay $few dollars a month…can i give hardware, software, cloud services for free…No…Can I reduce your overall cost…Yes!
As to what models…first of all, happy for you to pay me upfront all these monies (whatever you are paying now)…but i think its not a good model…
here is what i want…
Reduce the cost of hardware…
Create a proper platform for developers so that they can write proper applications and services (not just integration with devices we should have integrated out of box!!!) and push that in our appstore…This way, we get a continuous revenue stream, You the user get access to very cheap home automation and use it for free and only pay if you use a service that you think is valuable to you, therefore creating an ecosystem for developers as well.
Is it a short term business model. No.
Are we committed to make this happen, you bet your bottom dollar!We are working on such an exciting projects with ecosystem creating all sort of new applications/services that has huge value to end users, it will unlock the next stage of automation…We are here to catch the next wave…
If this is the direction we are going then I will be out !!! I rather pay the upfront cost and not have to worry about monthly fees. And I don’t want to be nickel and dimed for software apps that should be part of the core anyway. And i don’t want the headaches (stress) of trying to decide who’s app is the right app for what it is I am trying to do. I want a set and forget it, until I decide to change something, then set it and forget it again.
I absolutely expect firmware updates to products I buy for free !!! Almost everything in my house is updated that way: Sony TV, Soundbar, Playstation, Xbox, Pentair Pool module, Sunny Boy Solar web module, iPhone, iPad, Foscam cameras, … I don’t even think I could list everything that has free updates.
You will have to provide examples of what is a “service” that I will be willing to pay for above what the product (Vera) should be doing for me already.
I have a bad feeling about this…[/quote]
I completely agree on “randya’s” quote… This model is totally against the current Vera’s business model. If this is the model new Vera team is working on, then I am OUT of Vera and will consider other alternatives. I don’t think any other successful products out in market (as mentioned by randya) having succeeded with the pay-per service.
How will you guys differentiate your business model by monthly charging Security services like ADT, Alarm.com etc?
ditto!
Besides, a Vera Plus has dramatically worse HW specs than $35 USD Raspberry Pi 3 B+, so aside from a few extra dollars for the Z-Wave and Zigbee radio chips, the HW cost to MCV is extremely low.
Thus technically they already do use the Apple model. 8)
[quote=“melih, post:10, topic:199684”][quote=“Sammy2, post:1, topic:199684”]The new team at Vera seems to have set out on quite a project to overhaul the system. Without a LOT of new unit sales, I’m not so sure they can finance all this. Shall we expect a monthly fee based system going forward? Will we have to pay for each major f/w release or then only be able to stick to the one we’re on?
Questions I have that seem unanswered in all the fanfare.[/quote]
Everything has a cost of ownership!
You can either pay $200 upfront for hardware or pay $few dollars a month…can i give hardware, software, cloud services for free…No…Can I reduce your overall cost…Yes!
As to what models…first of all, happy for you to pay me upfront all these monies (whatever you are paying now)…but i think its not a good model…
here is what i want…
Reduce the cost of hardware…
Create a proper platform for developers so that they can write proper applications and services (not just integration with devices we should have integrated out of box!!!) and push that in our appstore…
This way, we get a continuous revenue stream, You the user get access to very cheap home automation and use it for free and only pay if you use a service that you think is valuable to you, therefore creating an ecosystem for developers as well.
Is it a short term business model. No.
Are we committed to make this happen, you bet your bottom dollar!
We are working on such an exciting projects with ecosystem creating all sort of new applications/services that has huge value to end users, it will unlock the next stage of automation…We are here to catch the next wave…[/quote]
Could you please claify the following:
I am one of the crowd who really prefers the one time payment model, as there is a significant point to knowing that the setup theoretically can run for years uninterupted by things like payment issues or other external factors.
I can fully understand (and even pay for) some optional functions at additional cost, but preferrably a one time cost. I would even consider buying some good functions at a montly fee, but there is a huge difference between having the option, and beeing forced to pay for it because it’s integral functionality.
This last thing is something i think would drive a lot of people here away, as that is not the concept they (we) bought in to…
[quote=“melih, post:10, topic:199684”]Everything has a cost of ownership!
You can either pay $200 upfront for hardware or pay $few dollars a month…can i give hardware, software, cloud services for free…No…Can I reduce your overall cost…Yes!
As to what models…first of all, happy for you to pay me upfront all these monies (whatever you are paying now)…but i think its not a good model…
here is what i want…
Reduce the cost of hardware…
Create a proper platform for developers so that they can write proper applications and services (not just integration with devices we should have integrated out of box!!!) and push that in our appstore…
This way, we get a continuous revenue stream, You the user get access to very cheap home automation and use it for free and only pay if you use a service that you think is valuable to you, therefore creating an ecosystem for developers as well.
Is it a short term business model. No.
Are we committed to make this happen, you bet your bottom dollar!
We are working on such an exciting projects with ecosystem creating all sort of new applications/services that has huge value to end users, it will unlock the next stage of automation…We are here to catch the next wave…[/quote]
Hi Melith,
I read between the lines that Apps from the should (could) be payed for. As an App developer my self I would not like Mois to charge for my work. I also do not want to charge for it as that gives false ideas on the level of support people will expect. I do not have the time for anything else than best effort and sometimes that can be months. If I had payed, even just $10,- I would not find that acceptable. It would also make you go head to head with HomeSheer and loose one of the few advantages you have over that platform.
Cheers Rene
If vera will go to a monthly fee, allbeit a partly montly fee or subscription or whatever it is called… I will also be out. I hope you will not do this Vera!
I chose vera for this main reason of not having a montly fee (and have had a lot of vera models in the past).
What I hope:
What we all currently have will remain “(monthly) free” And new functionality (not technology!) can be suspect to a montly fee and up to choice of the user.
How about that?
When I first read the official response my first thought was HomeSEER.
If I’m going to pay for each app like HomeSEER, I may as well run HomeSEER on a spare NUC i3 I have, or my rPi which is also not being used at present, waiting for something to use it for.
This does not bode well for Vera, or it’s existing users. Maybe new users won’t know or care but this is not the usage model I bought into.
I want to remind you also who you are competing with: I have been evaluating alternatives and this is what I am finding:
When so much of your functioning code is from the community, how are you going to charge for it?
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