Can I use an Aeotec Z-Stick with Vera Edge, rather than the internal radio? This seems that it would make inclusion much easier as the Edge could stay put as I move around to do inclusions.
Thanks, Pete
Can I use a usb zstick with Vera Edge (or will I be able to with the Vera Plus I’ve pre-ordered?)
If not, how do you do z-wave inclusions with Vera?
Thanks, Chapin
[quote=“Chapin, post:1, topic:190341”]Can I use an Aeotec Z-Stick with Vera Edge, rather than the internal radio? This seems that it would make inclusion much easier as the Edge could stay put as I move around to do inclusions.
Thanks, Pete[/quote]
or you could just leave both put and include the devices where they stay… Or you could get a battery pack for the edge probley cheaper then the z-stick. But the UI is much better to include rather then some blinking lights. That was how it was done in the old days.
No, you can’t use a z-stick.
You also cannot include on the Vera if it is a secondary controller, in most cases only the Primary controller can include new devices.
You can use the Vera UI to add new devices (just use the generic z-wave device if your device is not in the list), or you can use the buttons on the Vera. Using The UI is easier to understand what is going and walks you through delete /re-add if the device needs to be reset.
Did something change, that I wasn’t aware of? Using the Aeon stick as an alternative radio on the Vera Edge use to be supported. I would similarly expect it to work on the Vera Plus.
Probably my bad, I thought the question was, can you use the Z-Stick like a portable secondary controller to take it to other devices to include them. I wasn’t aware that you could remove the z-stick from the Vera (if being used as an alternative radio) and be-able to include devices.
It seems a portable stick for inclusion would be easier than dragging the Vera around. The controller needs to be within 1 meter or so of the device being included.
It is highly inconvenient to move the vera around to do inclusions. Besides power it also has a hard wired network connection.
It sounds like I will likely be able to use a zstick with the plus and that I can use a zstick with the edge today. Is there a downside to using a zstick vs the internal radio?
[quote=“Chapin, post:7, topic:190341”]It seems a portable stick for inclusion would be easier than dragging the Vera around. The controller needs to be within 1 meter or so of the device being included.
It is highly inconvenient to move the vera around to do inclusions. Besides power it also has a hard wired network connection.[/quote]
This is incorrect most devices if not all don’t need to be within 3 meters. Battery devices some time give you trouble and they might need that, but they are on battery and portable. I always pair before install. The only other ones I can see maybe giving you trouble is door locks. They are battery and need to be on the door.
This is nothing new and is called full power or High power inclusion and is the reason VERA stopped putting batteries in their VERA and making them portable. (but their is still a battery pack you can buy)
Vera edge and the new Plus both have wifi built in so hard wired is probley optional (I only hardwire)
[quote=“integlikewhoa, post:9, topic:190341”]This is incorrect most devices if not all don’t need to be within 3 meters. Battery devices some time give you trouble and they might need that, but they are on battery and portable. I always pair before install. The only other ones I can see maybe giving you trouble is door locks. They are battery and need to be on the door.
This is nothing new and is called full power or High power inclusion and is the reason VERA stopped putting batteries in their VERA and making them portable. (but their is still a battery pack you can buy)[/quote]
Is this true for earlier generation zwave devices? I understood that High Power inclusion only worked for newer generation devices.
[quote=“Chapin, post:10, topic:190341”][quote=“integlikewhoa, post:9, topic:190341”]This is incorrect most devices if not all don’t need to be within 3 meters. Battery devices some time give you trouble and they might need that, but they are on battery and portable. I always pair before install. The only other ones I can see maybe giving you trouble is door locks. They are battery and need to be on the door.
This is nothing new and is called full power or High power inclusion and is the reason VERA stopped putting batteries in their VERA and making them portable. (but their is still a battery pack you can buy)[/quote]
Is this true for earlier generation zwave devices? I understood that High Power inclusion only worked for newer generation devices.[/quote]
My devices go back fro around 3 years, so I couldn’t tell you what year and don’t know what devices you have. But here is a really old WIKI last updated in 2010 talking about it. Maybe it was new then?
Also for notes, I have a very large mesh now which makes this work even better. When your starting fresh you can’t try to pair the one on the opsite end of the house first… For obious reasons you should start pairing close to your vera box and move outward to build your mesh. Sometimes the mesh takes a day or two (to keep in mind when adding 20 devices in an hour) to run the nightly heels and map everything out for better communication (find it’s neighbors, and adjust routing).
I use alot of GE switches, MIMOlites and not so many battery devices. Maybe 10 total.
Leviton VRCS2 (double z-wave switch/scene) were the only devices hardwired that gave me trouble with the distance, but they gave me trouble withing a foot and I still don’t have one included the correct way either. Other then that i can add devices in a back detached garage (mesh already setup now) and have no problems being 75 feet away.
[quote=“integlikewhoa, post:11, topic:190341”]My devices go back fro around 3 years, so I couldn’t tell you what year and don’t know what devices you have. But here is a really old WIKI last updated in 2010 talking about it. Maybe it was new then?
http://wiki.micasaverde.com/index.php/Full_Power_Inclusion[/quote]
Thanks. I guess I will have to just try this.
My devices are primarily 8+ year old Leviton Vizio (pre Vizio+).
I did see this in the wiki you linked (thanks for that):
“Full power inclusion doesn’t always work. Only newer Z-Wave devices support it, and, they don’t always support the full ‘mesh network’ functions needed to reliably include. So you can use full power inclusion to pick up as many nodes as you can, and then remove Vera’s Z-Wave dongle and carry it around to pick up the nodes that you couldn’t get with full power inclusion.”
Z-Wave Plus has a feature called network wide inclusion(NWI) that allows for including Z-Wave Plus devices from anywhere within range of any node in the network. However, this feature is largely dependent upon the network being a homogenous Z-Wave plus network. Having older non-Z-Wave plus devices in the network can cause this feature to fail in certain instances.
With older standard(non-Z-Wave Plus) devices, most but not all, support Full Power Inclusion. The Leviton VRCS2-MRZ Vizia RF + 2-Button Scene Controller is one exception that immediately comes to mind. In my experience it seems to only support Low Power Inclusion.
With Full Power Inclusion, Z-Wave include operations broadcast a Network Information Frame(NIF) and subsequent acknowledgments at a higher radio frequency(RF) power that can reach farther and thus be heard by Vera from a longer distance than the low power inclusion. But, the full power inclusion is a broadcast that must be heard by Vera directly, it does not route through the Z-Wave network as NWI does in Z-Wave Plus.
What this all means is that, as @integlikewhoa stated, a lot of times inclusion of mains powered Z-Wave devices can occur at far greater than the 1 meter recommendation. But to simplify instructions and reduce complicated descriptions, such as mine, manufacturers recommend including at a 1 meter distance. This short distance will always work. Other distances mostly work, but sometimes fail, resulting in vitriolic forum posts about Vera and a new device not working and the consumers resulting disappointment/anger.
The only downsides that I foresee to using a Z-Stick instead of the built-in radio are; expense of redundant radios, fragility and possibility of breaking off the stick plugged into Vera, appearance issues…
Thanks. Think I will try a Zstick with Vera.
[/quote]
Vera edge and the new Plus both have wifi built in so hard wired is probley optional (I only hardwire)
[/quote]
Vera Plus unit doesn’t support WiFi just yet. It can only be hardwired. I used to use my vera 2 as a bridge and it worked great as a bridge. The Vera plus doesn’t allow this mode at all unfortunately. I will have to buy another bridge in order to keep my network up and running where I need placement of the device.