Strange things happening w/ Trane T-stat

Other Devices & Integrations Climate Control & Temperature Sensors
1

Vera 2 UI5

Hi all,

This one has me scratching my head. I have a number of Trane thermostats in my warehouse. One of them is acting really weird.

Whether one changes the temp manually, or by a scene, this thermostat will lower the temp and display the correct temp. BUT, when you try to raise the temp, it will only raise a few degrees.

Example. Set to Heat, Normal, Auto Change temp to 55 . The web UI shows the temp going to 55, and the thermostat goes to 55. A scene will show the green bar at the bottom to signify that the T-stat got the command successfully. Everything fine.

Now, changing the temp from 55 to 64 The web UI shows the temp at 64, the green bar shows the command was received, BUT- the Tstat shows 58 and will not go above that value no matter what I do. It doesn’t matter if I set it to 64 or 69 or any value higher than 58.

Anyone have any idea what could be going on here? Why does the UI show that the temp changed and was received?

Thanks in advance…

2

I have a Vera2 and Trane thermostat. Over the past 2 years, when I’ve had weird issues going on, the quickest fix was to unplug the thermostat from the wall mount and plug it back in. Always worked for me.

3

Are you able to manually go higher than 58 on that thermostat? If yes, it may be an issue with the zwave connection and perhaps pulling it off teh wall and replacing it will reset it. Is it’s firmware versions the same as the others?

If you have the same problem with manually setting it, have you checked the ESM setpoints in the thermostat and verified the upper one is not set to 58? There is also a ‘hidden’ installer menu that has some setpoint settings but I forget how to access it.

4

We can manually change the temp without any problem.

The weird part here is that zwave will lower the temp but not raise it past a certain point. So, zwave works- sort of!

I am going to try and disconnect the unit on Monday to see if that resets the stat. Thanks for suggestion.

I don’t know how the firmware on that stat compares to the others.

5

On the thermostat, go into the menu and look for the Info item. That would give you firmware etc values.
I’m at work so I have no physical access to my Trane Thermostat to get the exact name and location of that Info menu item.

6

I too have really weird things happening to my Trane stat:
Model: TZEMT400BB32
FwVer: 02.02.15
ZVer: 2.13
Configured as: FanType=“Gas”, SystemType: “Standard”

My Trane reboots itself often after a zWave initiated temperature change but not every time.

It seems that Vera on Ui5 is bugging this stat perhaps by trying to set data fields that are irrelevant for what that model can handle… It seems to me the problem is when Vera sets the Heat temp. Some data in the AutoConfig is definitely NOT COMPATIBLE with the way things should be. It is pushing this Trane over the edge…

The Ambient Temperature read-out/polling funtionality seems to work just fine. Never get crazy numbers. The Vera log shows chating every 15 seconds or so.

The neighborhood mesh is real strong with full-power devices: 3,4,6,7,8,10.
I use it:

  • Always set as HEAT only (no in/out of Saver)
  • Fan set as Auto
  • Heat= 69 or Heat=66 really simple stufff!
    I have tried with Polling=30 and without=0… same “Trane wreck” !

What I see is that the MCU that runs the Trane electronic board eventually gets so confused, it triggers its on-board Whatchdog that reboots the whole thing - The Trane MCU (a fancy CPU with I/O’s, Ram, Rom etc) is what listens to the zWave module, it is what reads the front panel buttons and what manages the display.
That is far from a functional service on the Vera side. I am saying it is Vera’s fault because when I controled my zWave network without a Vera, I had no such problem of confused stat rebooting now and then.

To sum things up what we really need to do is pop the hood and learn how to debug/Troubleshoot the chating between Vera and Stat – How?? (I am new around Vera!)

In the end the solution could be a single variable setting or a template issue… ::slight_smile:

In particular the UPnP log entry does not look too good:

02      11/17/14 14:10:49.783   ZZZ-POLLING H1,C1,H2,C2,/1/1 <0x2c381680>

This zWave stat is THREE STAGE HEAT + TWO STAGE COOL capable… so one could expect: H1,C1,H2,C2,H3,C2 not H1,C1,H2,C2,/1/1 who knows, really?

-------- Another lead in the “Energy Saving Mode” implementation…
When I set “Energy” from Ui5, the Stat goes into “Energy Saving Mode”: that is good!
But when I manually come out of “Energy Saving Mode” by setting “Run mode” on the Stat: Vera does display the new H/C setpoint Temps but is unable to update its “Energy/Normal” mode !

So it seems there an issue or a limitation with “mode setting” being out of Sync (eventhough temps keep updating/sync’ing as usual ie. zWave connection is functional)
Vera can change the Trane “ESM/RUN” mode but Trane can not change the Vera mode to reflect the correct “Energy/Normal”. One way only setting: Vera > Trane.

Interesting, isn’t it?? ;D

7

Do you have the mode in “auto”? If so, my guess is it has something to do with that. When in auto the stat has a cooling and heating temperature set point with a set differential between them that I think is 3 degrees. The 3 degree difference is what made me think this might be the problem. Good luck!

8

Nop I only run in “Auto” because my Trane only controls a heater/furnace, no AC gear…

Being new to this Vera and this type of problemes, I’ve done some reading & testing to seek a solution - At this point I am leaning towards an incompatibility with Vera’s advanced routing options.
? For now, I’ve unticked “Limit neighbors to Z-Wave discovery” to let devices do their own zWave thing…?

9

Well, I unplugged it, remounted it, and… no change. Still acting bizarre. I have a spare and am thinking about changing it out. Not sure what else to so. Rebooted the Vera multiple times w/ no change.

10

[quote=“ballroller, post:9, topic:184145”]Well, I unplugged it, remounted it, and… no change. Still acting bizarre. I have a spare and am thinking about changing it out. Not sure what else to so. Rebooted the Vera multiple times w/ no change.[/quote] try disabling the routing option, it seems to be good so far = Faster response time too

11

Are you getting any data under “Usage Graph” in the Tstat itself??

My stat shows no data despite hours of runtime. Same blank data under Filter Sce or Maint Sce screens !

Perhaps this is all a side effect of Trane spontaneous reboots ?? At this point I believe the zWave data stream is what is causing these reboots… like something in the payload is upseting my Tstat.

12

Based on hands-on testing it looks like Tstat can handle only one set of commands at the time, no batched/multiple settings.

Ex: “Away” mode can NOT set target temps and Heat mode (Heat/Cool/Auto/Off) and schedule (ESM/Normal)

When multiple settings are sent : commands are mostly droped/ignored.:-

The workaround may be to add 5s wait cycles between distinct classes of settings to allow the Tstat to process commands as “one by one” and have a break before next set.

The only multiple setting I see can be updated at the same time is Temp “Heat/Cool” (because it is in the same class)

This device is what it is… we may as well learn to work with it !!

  • I sure would not recommend it to any prospective buyer… ::slight_smile:
13

I haven’t found this to be the case w/ my Trane Tstats. I can set any option that’s available to me with one command.

[quote=“ElGringoCurioso, post:12, topic:184145”]Based on hands-on testing it looks like Tstat can handle only one set of commands at the time, no batched/multiple settings.

Ex: “Away” mode can NOT set target temps and Heat mode (Heat/Cool/Auto/Off) and schedule (ESM/Normal)

When multiple settings are sent : commands are mostly droped/ignored.:-

The workaround may be to add 5s wait cycles between distinct classes of settings to allow the Tstat to process commands as “one by one” and have a break before next set.

The only multiple setting I see can be updated at the same time is Temp “Heat/Cool” (because it is in the same class)

This device is what it is… we may as well learn to work with it !!

  • I sure would not recommend it to any prospective buyer… ::)[/quote]
14

[quote=“ballroller”]I haven’t found this to be the case w/ my Trane Tstats. I can set any option that’s available to me with one command.

[quote=“ElGringoCurioso, post:12, topic:184145”]Based on hands-on testing it looks like Tstat can handle only one set of commands at the time, no batched/multiple settings.

Ex: “Away” mode can NOT set target temps and Heat mode (Heat/Cool/Auto/Off) and schedule (ESM/Normal)

When multiple settings are sent : commands are mostly droped/ignored.:-

The workaround may be to add 5s wait cycles between distinct classes of settings to allow the Tstat to process commands as “one by one” and have a break before next set.

The only multiple setting I see can be updated at the same time is Temp “Heat/Cool” (because it is in the same class)

This device is what it is… we may as well learn to work with it !!

  • I sure would not recommend it to any prospective buyer… ::)[/quote][/quote]
    Thanks for your reply BallRoller. It’s good to know your Trane can handle batched commands.

What version specifics are you running?

I am on Ui5 with TZEMT400BB32:

  • ver: 02.02.15
  • zVer: 2.13
    It’s routing directly to VeraLt (0-5,…)

Does your Usage Graph show any run time?

(I saw my tstat reboot all by itself again today during a quiet time without active zwave commands)

15

I have couple tips to share as far as reboots and blank useage logs.

I’ve finally tracked down that my heat-only furnace made by HEIL actualy cuts-off the 24VAC transformer primary 110VAC as part of it’s heat cycle and the Tstat needs a 24VAC non-stop. When the Pwr supply is lost so are the run-time logs!!

During the heat cycle the (130,000 Btu) furnace fires its 5 gas burner until the high limit temperature switch senses the heat exchanger has reached it high limit and cuts off the 110VAC to the 24V transformer that powers the gas valves. At that point the blower fan keeps going until the heat exchanger temperature sensor reaches lower temperature and supply 24VAC to fire the burners again - That’s a heat cycle!

At first I thought coil spikes on the 24Ac were buging out the Tstat MCU so I went about cleaning it out with RC filters. That made the zwave module much more responsive… no more command “Failures” when sending new temp settings. Couple 0.1uF caps in the Tstat Pwr supply section near the battery 3.3VDC regulator chip.

To stop the rebooting I wired in a cheap multi-voltage doorbell transformer from HomeDepot store as follow:
24C: 24Vsupply to Tstat only
24Rh/Rc: common 24V supply for: Tstat and Furnace inputs
W1: Heat demand input from Tstat (gets “24Rh” switched)

Basically the furnace 24Common is no longer exposed to Tstat, it stays in the furnace to work it’s valves.
The new tranformer uses the 24C wire going up to Tstat and the 24Rh wire is shared with furnace 24VAC (if you wire both transformer “in-phase” you don’t create 48VAC by being out of sinewave phase).

Now all is good… besides the Tstat enforcing a “Wait” time out period after each ON cycle regardless the fact it is setup as Gas only furnace in Heat only mode (not a Ac heat pump).