I’m not sure about anyone else, but the length of some of the posts now for the popular plugins are getting so long. So much so that it takes ages to read up on them and you find people (myself included) asking the same questions, as the plugin has changed so much.
Would people support my desire for MCV to create a child boards for released/approved plugins like they have done for the Remote Controls section.
It’s always good to have a poll every now and again, so I thought I would create a Poll to see the mood of this forum to such an approach.
Please have a look at the yes/no choice above and VOTE NOW!
No sure how many votes I need to get an official comment from one of the MCV admins, but I hope it’s not the same as what you need to get a bill proposed at the houses of parliament in the UK (some 100,000)
Spot check suggests 8 out of 10 would like dedicated plugin child boards, allowing threads and conversations to be more structured.
Thanks MCVflorin - Is this something that you would progress ?
A good case in point to support this - is for the Weather Plugin - the mios.app could then link to the new (child) post and not the historical one that has run since the first iteration.
The Sonos Plugin, would be another one I would like to see as a stand alone.
Some other things to put out there for comment/discussion
1 - Does there need to be some form of selection criteria before a plugin moves into a child board? e.g when deemed released to the public, deemed Alpha, Beta etc?
2 - When does a Plugin become an App? - is it maybe when it’s published on mios?
3 - Would released Plugin/Apps be better served in a dedicated section under ‘General’ leaving the Advanced section to stay focussed on coding/scripting etc? E.g so when point 1. (above) is met it can be moved out of programming etc. slowing it to stand alone.?
4 - If stays as is, the child boards may eventually grow quite big, if so, then I would like to suggest that the ‘Plugin Development’ section should also become a child board too, so posts are not lost at the very bottom. (I miss the Remote Control one due to the growing child board list there too)
[quote=“parkerc, post:7, topic:172721”]- Some other things to put out there for comment/discussion
…
3 - Would released Plugin/Apps be better served in a dedicated section under ‘General’ leaving the Advanced section to stay focussed on coding/scripting etc? E.g so when point 1. (above) is met it can be moved out of programming etc. slowing it to stand alone.?[/quote]
I definitely agree with this one. In fact, having what amounts to an end-user (from a plugin developer perspective) support forum buried under the “Advanced → Programming” section makes no sense. I would guess many end users wouldn’t even think to look here. Most software development efforts typically have two sets of forums / mailing lists: one for the developers of the software, and another for supporting the end users. I think a “Plugins” forum under “General” (with possible subboards for popular plugins) would be great way to go. Or, just move the plug-in topics to the appropriate existing sub-forum (lighting, HVAC, energy, etc.) based on the type of plugin. The “Plugin & Plugin Development” forum could stay here, but I think it should be renamed to “Plugin Development” and make it for programming questions only.
That way the non technical users don’t have to wade through useless technical information, and vise-versa.
So far the criterion was only the number of replies: I created child boards only for threads with over 400 replies. This was to keep the number of child boards relatively low. This is not set in stone, so if someone else has other ideas, let me know.
For me they are the same thing. The plugins are called ‘apps’ because it’s the more “popular” word.
At 300 replies, it doesn’t meet the current criteria to create a child board for it. If someone disagrees, shout here.
The following is just an idea on how you could potential improve the layout of the forums Advanced section initially started by @Guessed (I think) . My thoughts are simply to just separate the ‘Plugins’ from the ‘Plugin development/programming’ side - that way you could create a greater focus on all the available/released plugins/apps…
Plugins would be moved under ‘App Store Releases’ as part of their push into production and on to the App Store, such a move will also allows their new forum thread location to be made part of the apps help section too etc.
Plugins could be moved under ‘Alpha/Beta Releases’ when they’re ready for UAT testing and forum feedback, a sort of Staging area. This will allow users (and MCV) to see all the potential plugins that are available and have the potential for an App Store release.
[size=12pt]Programming & Plugin Development[/size]
Open posts where all the plugin development questions are discussed
I like the idea of a minimum post-count to act as a natural barrier to “forum explosion”. It’s very easy to have an overwhelming # of sub-boards for stuff and the post-count, or maybe view-count, requirement should help keep that to a minimum.
Child boards can very quickly get out of hand. It is [somewhat] contained with Remote’s board, as there’s a limit to how many people will code them and, as a result, the number of child boards.
For plugins, authors wanting to represent status for their plugins can do that within the first post of any thread they establish for the discussion. There’s also a master Wiki page for all of the plugins that could be updated for the task as well.
Overall, we need the board to be more self-service, using options that are freely available to community members, and not requiring administrative oversight.
I don’t support having boards for alpha/beta stuff, as that requires administrative maintenance as each plugin matures, making it less self-service overall.
[quote=“guessed, post:11, topic:172721”]Overall, we need the board to be more self-service, using options that are freely available to community members, and not requiring administrative oversight.
I don’t support having boards for alpha/beta stuff, as that requires administrative maintenance as each plugin matures, making it less self-service overall.[/quote]
I also agree with the self service approach as much as possible, however as this forum seems to be the engine room from the majority of Vera add-ons, I think it would benefit from a bit more structure in that area, and I was keen to try and show the evolution of plugins.
Also a key differentiator (for me) between an ‘App Store’’ release and a beta/alpha is as follows. (Correct me if I am wrong)
it has been reviewed and signed off by MCV
it is part of the UI5 & MIOS App Store
you have the ability to auto update, removing any need to manually update for bugs or new features
So segregating those two - shows their’s a barrier between the two, and to some degree there’s also a risk involved in downloading/installing a beta/alpha plugin. E.g. Guessed and ankers Sonos plugin and lolodomo’ RFXcom rfxrtx433 are heavily utilised , yet still not ‘official’ releases yet, so MCV might want to emphasis more a disclaimer, rather than having production and test releases mixed.
And just to be clear, I would still recommend the use of a similar promotion criteria for child boards to be created in those proposed new categories.
Good discussion this
I love this forum and have huge respect for the guys who develop the plugins, but being a user, I’d personally like to see just a little more segregation in this one area, especially as I find myself spending so much of my time there.
