Has any one had success with this? I have tried several things to get this to work with out any luck. Any time I remove internet access from the device I just get a spinning wheel (think it’s trying to get weather data), and once I got it to load but if you go to setting or anything it tries to go to a login page which it can’t reach because it’s offline.
I’ve contacted support, but after going back and forth many times they finally said the only way it’s possible is to setup the edge as being my DHCP server and setup very specific ports for each machine etc. I do not want to redo my entire LAN for the edge to work offline, but I do not want a cloud based service.
Is this really the case? Can I not use the edge with out the internet? Has anyone gotten a VeraEdge to work without internet and without jumping through hoops to make it work?
[quote=“Erasmuz, post:1, topic:187279”]Supposedly the vera works offline.
Has any one had success with this? I have tried several things to get this to work with out any luck. Any time I remove internet access from the device I just get a spinning wheel (think it’s trying to get weather data), and once I got it to load but if you go to setting or anything it tries to go to a login page which it can’t reach because it’s offline.
I’ve contacted support, but after going back and forth many times they finally said the only way it’s possible is to setup the edge as being my DHCP server and setup very specific ports for each machine etc. I do not want to redo my entire LAN for the edge to work offline, but I do not want a cloud based service.
Is this really the case? Can I not use the edge with out the internet? Has anyone gotten a VeraEdge to work without internet and without jumping through hoops to make it work?[/quote]
The edge works without internet. You can turn on and off lights, you can run scenes, you can add and remove devices…
If you try to go into accounts, users, location services, backups and such then it requires cloud based storage and security information. Depending on which plugins and such you have installed, they also depend alot on internet for weather, sunrise/sunset, and other things.
So if your internet is down for a day your apps and lights and scenes continue to work. If you have no internet at all in your house, your going to limit yourself on the alot of things as lets face it in this world today the internet is more important then tv.
@tomtcom - This is using my local ip, not trying to login through the portal (the device is offline, so I know that the portal won’t work).
@integlikewhoa - I can not do any of the things you mentioned. I get a spinning wheel of death, and no user interface. I can’t run scenes, add/remove devices, toggle lights, etc.
I get nothing. There was the one fluke as mentioned (1/100 tries and letting it try and load for way too long each time) that for some reason it worked, but I still couldn’t access settings. I couldn’t even view logs because it wanted me to login.
I kind of understand editing users having to go through the portal (not really though since the reason I bought the device was because the info said it will work completely offline), but everything else (again even logs, and net/wifi, etc needing the internet?) seems to conflict with what vera boasts about it’s capabilities.
[quote=“Erasmuz, post:4, topic:187279”]@tomtcom - This is using my local ip, not trying to login through the portal (the device is offline, so I know that the portal won’t work).
@integlikewhoa - I can not do any of the things you mentioned. I get a spinning wheel of death, and no user interface. I can’t run scenes, add/remove devices, toggle lights, etc.
I get nothing. There was the one fluke as mentioned (1/100 tries and letting it try and load for way too long each time) that for some reason it worked, but I still couldn’t access settings. I couldn’t even view logs because it wanted me to login.
I kind of understand editing users having to go through the portal (not really though since the reason I bought the device was because the info said it will work completely offline), but everything else (again even logs, and net/wifi, etc needing the internet?) seems to conflict with what vera boasts about it’s capabilities.[/quote]
You have an issue with something then if you have the spinning wheel for more then a min or two. “Completely” offline is not possible. That would assume there is no reason for Vera to have an Ethernet port. Which I tell everyone vera needs internet for day to day use. Only if internet is dropped it will continue to function unlike alot of other boxes. But for me 50% of my plugins are IP and internet based. Sure my local IP stuff will work but I relay on internet for alot of things and so does vera.
All secure vera logins are internet based (no login needed local). All backups and restores are designed for cloud (daily) backups. Vera tech support logins in via internet for support. Software updates are via online self check. Timezone info and weather info is all found online. So to think everything is going to work the same with or without internet is not true.
I couldn’t do some things on UI7 running on my Vera Lite without being connected to the Internet, such as local backups, the very first thing I tried. Requiring the Edge be your DHCP server just doesn’t make any sense to me. I have a Mac Mini that acts as my DHCP and DNS server. My Vera Lite has a static address. Environmental data that I use for scenes comes from a server that runs my weather station. There is nothing outside of my LAN that my Vera Lite running UI5 needs that I can think of. That is why UI7 was a non-starter for me. That is not to say that I don’t want to connect to the cloud, I do, but it cannot be a requirement.
I don’t understand why everyone always thinks that sunrise / sunset has to be done server-side. it’s just a calculation of time, latitude and longitude.
I too am super frustrated at the product direction to not operate as a stand alone appliance. Having simple router-style client side password authentication and accounts seems like such an obvious way of doing this that they just refuse to do.
[quote=“sortadan, post:7, topic:187279”]I don’t understand why everyone always thinks that sunrise / sunset has to be done server-side. it’s just a calculation of time, latitude and longitude.
I too am super frustrated at the product direction to not operate as a stand alone appliance. Having simple router-style client side password authentication and accounts seems like such an obvious way of doing this that they just refuse to do.[/quote]
Currently unless you wrote your own plugin sunrise and sunset times come from google. But that hardly is the only issue when you don;t have internet. You don’t even have to base your scenes off sunrise or sunset.
So It still stands VERA works without internet but not 100%, happy as you maybe that’s how it currently is.
So I would argue that VERA doesn’t work with-out internet. z-wave does, but I can’t even get the main screen to load on my vera edge running UI7 with out internet. I may try to see about installing UI5 because requiring the internet is a huge draw back for me.
The main reason for this draw back is I would like to get my vera setup stable and leave it off the internet. The reason for this is because looking into the future I plan on selling my house. When selling I would like the system to work, especially if I move out first and take my router with me. I plan on selling the home automation / security (elk m1 gold) system as part of the house. Trying to inform potential buyers of where to login to and password info for a cloud based home is a huge turn off for many buyers. Instead, if it just works, and I can inform them the controller can be accessed if needed via LAN is a much better / easier / understandable selling point.
@integlikewhoa Or you could use Heliotrope and your own NTP server like I do. If I loose my Internet for a couple of days, my time won’t drift that much, and even so it will still work. Folks like me don’t like UI7s dependency on GetVera’s servers and why should we? Where is the up side for us? I don’t understand why you think it is okay. You are okay with it, I am not.
@integlikewhoa Or you could use Heliotrope and your own NTP server like I do. If I loose my Internet for a couple of days, my time won’t drift that much, and even so it will still work. Folks like me don’t like UI7s dependency on GetVera’s servers and why should we? Where is the up side for us? I don’t understand why you think it is okay. You are okay with it, I am not.[/quote]
I’m not relying on their servers as much as relying on internet. Richards day and night plugin, my geofences (away from home), weather underground plugin and more rely on internet not vera’s servers. Since being on ui7 (over 6 months) I have had a total of 2 times for no more then 4 hours each vera’s servers were down. VPN in easy took care of my problems until servers where back up. But the point is it’s not a big enough issue to create a huge scene over. And again this thread is about no internet not Vera servers. Big difference.
I take it that he doesn’t like the fact that he cannot login without their servers and I don’t either. I wish they would change it.[/quote]
Could be, I see the word “No Internet” in the title and remove from internet several times. He also has a different issue as he can’t even get a home page or any devices or scenes to show up without the internet as he posted. Only the green spinning wheel, which should not happen even without vera servers.
You also have to remember that 99% of the users want remote access to their vera and probley 90% of them also don’t want or know how to setup a VPN with a DNS server or the like to make their own secure tunnel to vera.
You would think that maintaing VERA servers for a large user base, that has to use them, and pays no monthly fee would be a downside for VERA. But I think the upside is that 99% of there customers want and need them for easy setup and daily remote use/backups. Altho I think they could work it out I don’t see it happening.
What does that have to do with the fact that some people, including me don’t want to rely on Vera’s servers? Where does it leave us if Vera goes belly up? Maybe you think that could never happen. They have made the decision that some of the functionality is disabled if you cannot connect to their servers. I don’t think for one minute they are doing it just because they are nice folks. So I want UI7 completely unlocked. Where is the problem with that?
Features in Vera have 3 types of connectivity to Vera Servers:
NONE (i.e. Local Access to my Vera via Dashboard with NO security requested)
Occasional (i.e. Backups, Local Access to Dashboard with Security, Download Plugins)
All the Time (i.e. Event Notification Using Vera Services, Camera Storage, Remote Access to Dashboard)
Different people have different needs. Some people WANT/NEED the features that have access to the Vera Servers.
Vera would NOT be as successful as it is today (people can argue about how successful they are) if it limited itself to #1
You can argue if a particular feature or work flow should rely on Vera Servers … but the following statement does not make sense:
What does that have to do with the fact that some people, including me don’t want to rely on Vera’s servers? Where does it leave us if Vera goes belly up? Maybe you think that could never happen. They have made the decision that some of the functionality is disabled if you cannot connect to their servers. I don’t think for one minute they are doing it just because they are nice folks. So I want UI7 completely unlocked. Where is the problem with that?[/quote]
There is no problem with you wanting. Everyone want’s something but there has to be enough of a demand or “want” for VERA to find a way to execute and do it.
If vera goes belly up you have a controller that still works locally without backups. Personally I probley wouldn’t stick around much. That means UI updates would be no more, newer device support will be no more and if they were to happen soon. With all the new z-wave plus devices and ui changes that need to be done you better off throwing out that 130.00 vera (or less) and moving to something else. VERA is not a 1,000 piece of hardware you have sold you soul to like Homeseer.
I can at least now conclude that despite vera’s advertisement that the vera will not work offline.
This was the main feature the vera had that I thought made it stand out. If I wanted a cloud based solution I would have gone with HomeSeer. I was literally debating between the two and when I found out that the homeseer is a cloud based solution I immediately went with the vera. I now have to debate fighting to get ui5 working or go the razberry route.
Thanks for the feedback people, and if someone does find a way to run it offline please send me a message, I would love to get this device running solo.
Oh, and for every one debating if it should or shouldn’t be cloud based, or if it needs to be or not, etc… the fact is they say the device can work offline. It doesn’t. I don’t care if it needs to, I just wish that if it does need internet connectivity they would say so instead of boasting the product works when the internet is down. Because, as I mentioned earlier in the thread, the z-wave network continues to function when the internet is down, but the device (vera edge) does not.
This is really false information. The edge does continue to work when internet is out. I have 2 of them. As said before if your main page doesn’t load then you have an issue that needs to be addressed but this is not normal. Could be a setting you change in the network settings or a firmware issue, but thats not normal.
ui5 can not be installed on the vera edge due to z-wave plus chip.
I just tested it again myself using Chrome, vera edge and the latest ui7.
I unplugged the wan (ethernet from my cable modem to the router) from the router to kill all internet coming in the house without disabling the local network.
Logging into the static edge ip (for me is 192.168.1.212) I have set.
The page does take about 3 times longer to load then normal as its trying to connect to the net. But the page loads I’m able to click on devices tab or dashboard or scenes and certain settings.
More importantly the mobile app i use on my devices (imperihome) all function fast and without any issues or lag (unlike the first loading of the UI in a web browser)
So to say the edge doesn’t work without internet is complete BS, unless you have a specific issue on your end or you mean one specific test your trying doesn’t work. But the unit overall works.
First two photos are with internet down (notice the “No Internet Access” in the first picture), last photo shows after I have restored internet to it.
I’m not out to accuse vera or giving false info (I would rather it be that I did something stupid, which happens, and it works great offline ). It could be that I screwed up my settings. I didn’t just remove the internet, I had my router block the internet from just the vera. Maybe that’s the issue… the vera thinks it should have internet and freezing? Again, I’ll do the simple thing and turn off my modem and see what happens.
Again, sorry for making people upset. I’m not trying to give false info, or give vera a bad name, I just wanted to know if it works. Which is why I came to the forum to see if others have had success or if it was just an issue on my end, or my box.
). It could be that I screwed up my settings. I didn’t just remove the internet, I had my router block the internet from just the vera. Maybe that’s the issue… the vera thinks it should have internet and freezing? Again, I’ll do the simple thing and turn off my modem and see what happens.