[quote=“John M., post:2, topic:195573”]Hi fuzzysb,
Sorry to see you leaving.
If it’s something we can do to change your mind, or if you decide to come back, don’t hesitate to let us know.[/quote]
@John M.
Hope you have read all of the posts in the thread… The comments on this forum have been pretty much consistent for quite some time. Many of us are still on UI5 and plan to stay there until the stability problems are fixed.
Z
I’ve seen some people saying HS3 on Linux is the poor step child without all the features which is something that’s kept me away from it. You are saying that HS3 on the RPI is good? I’m more comfortable running on Linux than Windows. Thanks.
i just took a look at HS
it would cost me at least $600 to switch… that’s way to much for software IMO.
my veraplus isn’t perfect… but it works most of the time without problem.
guess it depends on how much disposable cash you have and how important it is for your lights to turn on and off when they are asked to.
good luck![/quote]
How did you figure $600?
I bought the following:
Rpi 3 - $35 ($50 as a kit with sd card and power adapter)
Zwave stick - $40
HS3 - $250 (bought it for $125 on sale)
Alternatively, you can buy the rpi based Zee S2, which comes with all the hardware and software you need for $199 (limited to 5 plugins but I only use 3 so it wouldn’t matter: zwave, imperihome and hstouch)
You definitely do not need HS3pro, and I only use one paid plugin (imperihome) but there are free options for mobile apps.
The rpi is probably one of the slowest devices out there you can run hs3 on, and it still runs circles around the fastest vera hardware in terms of power and reliability. And it has a ton more ram. It has been rock solid in my experience.[/quote]
Depends a lot on your plugin needs. I just counted what I would be buying if I was to have the same integration I currently have… Added up to $400 in plugins alone and I am sure I am missing some. HS3Pro may help but I am fairly certain a lot of the plugins I need are 3rd party.
i just took a look at HS
it would cost me at least $600 to switch… that’s way to much for software IMO.
my veraplus isn’t perfect… but it works most of the time without problem.
guess it depends on how much disposable cash you have and how important it is for your lights to turn on and off when they are asked to.
good luck![/quote]
How did you figure $600?
I bought the following:
Rpi 3 - $35 ($50 as a kit with sd card and power adapter)
Zwave stick - $40
HS3 - $250 (bought it for $125 on sale)
Alternatively, you can buy the rpi based Zee S2, which comes with all the hardware and software you need for $199 (limited to 5 plugins but I only use 3 so it wouldn’t matter: zwave, imperihome and hstouch)
You definitely do not need HS3pro, and I only use one paid plugin (imperihome) but there are free options for mobile apps.
The rpi is probably one of the slowest devices out there you can run hs3 on, and it still runs circles around the fastest vera hardware in terms of power and reliability. And it has a ton more ram. It has been rock solid in my experience.[/quote]
the plugin’s that i use now (for free) are 30-40$ each
200 on the software, and then 400 in plugins. (roughly)
IF HS lowered the price and made plugins free. they would have a flood of new customers.
i don’t mind the 200 for the software… it’s the plugins price that i have an issue with.
i just took a look at HS
it would cost me at least $600 to switch… that’s way to much for software IMO.
my veraplus isn’t perfect… but it works most of the time without problem.
guess it depends on how much disposable cash you have and how important it is for your lights to turn on and off when they are asked to.
good luck![/quote]
How did you figure $600?
I bought the following:
Rpi 3 - $35 ($50 as a kit with sd card and power adapter)
Zwave stick - $40
HS3 - $250 (bought it for $125 on sale)
Alternatively, you can buy the rpi based Zee S2, which comes with all the hardware and software you need for $199 (limited to 5 plugins but I only use 3 so it wouldn’t matter: zwave, imperihome and hstouch)
You definitely do not need HS3pro, and I only use one paid plugin (imperihome) but there are free options for mobile apps.
The rpi is probably one of the slowest devices out there you can run hs3 on, and it still runs circles around the fastest vera hardware in terms of power and reliability. And it has a ton more ram. It has been rock solid in my experience.[/quote]
the plugin’s that i use now (for free) are 30-40$ each
200 on the software, and then 400 in plugins. (roughly)
IF HS lowered the price and made plugins free. they would have a flood of new customers.
i don’t mind the 200 for the software… it’s the plugins price that i have an issue with.[/quote]
Also, remember that for HS they charge for software upgrades, so the money train continues to run… Every time they upgrade the software they charge you for the upgrade.
Z
I also migrated to HS3, but agree on the Plugin costs. Which I knew in advance.
With Vera, it’s cool to control my Hue’s and add my Harmonies. But is it $40 and $40 cool???
I’ve seen some people saying HS3 on Linux is the poor step child without all the features which is something that’s kept me away from it. You are saying that HS3 on the RPI is good? I’m more comfortable running on Linux than Windows. Thanks.[/quote]
Not really. I mean homeseer has a commercial hardware product based on the pi (linux arm), so no it’s not worse compared to the windows version. Actually, it is the future in my opinion.
The only thing I’m aware of that doesn’t work under Linux is the voice commands built into homeseer because they use Microsoft’s api. But I wouldn’t use it because nowadays you use an echo or a google home for that, which hs3 in linux supports.
i just took a look at HS
it would cost me at least $600 to switch… that’s way to much for software IMO.
my veraplus isn’t perfect… but it works most of the time without problem.
guess it depends on how much disposable cash you have and how important it is for your lights to turn on and off when they are asked to.
good luck![/quote]
How did you figure $600?
I bought the following:
Rpi 3 - $35 ($50 as a kit with sd card and power adapter)
Zwave stick - $40
HS3 - $250 (bought it for $125 on sale)
Alternatively, you can buy the rpi based Zee S2, which comes with all the hardware and software you need for $199 (limited to 5 plugins but I only use 3 so it wouldn’t matter: zwave, imperihome and hstouch)
You definitely do not need HS3pro, and I only use one paid plugin (imperihome) but there are free options for mobile apps.
The rpi is probably one of the slowest devices out there you can run hs3 on, and it still runs circles around the fastest vera hardware in terms of power and reliability. And it has a ton more ram. It has been rock solid in my experience.[/quote]
the plugin’s that i use now (for free) are 30-40$ each
200 on the software, and then 400 in plugins. (roughly)
IF HS lowered the price and made plugins free. they would have a flood of new customers.
i don’t mind the 200 for the software… it’s the plugins price that i have an issue with.[/quote]
Also, remember that for HS they charge for software upgrades, so the money train continues to run… Every time they upgrade the software they charge you for the upgrade.
Z[/quote]
They only charge an upgrade fee for major versions like going from hs2 to hs3 but that’s not frequent at all. Hs3 came out several years ago and it is still getting free upgrades with no hs4 even mentioned.
And granted, hs3 was a huge upgrade that it was more of a complete rewrite of the software.
I’m curious which plugins you guys need that adds up to $400 ;D
My main needs are mostly built in or free: zwave, alexa, ifttt, json api, advanced scene logic (pleg-like), etc.
I bought imperihome because that’s my favorite mobile app, and considered buying the kodi plugin, but instead implemented the play/pause notification feature (only one I needed) through the json api instead.
All my lights, garage doors, fireplace, etc just work as is.
[quote=“aptalca, post:29, topic:195573”]I’m curious which plugins you guys need that adds up to $400 ;D
My main needs are mostly built in or free: zwave, alexa, ifttt, json api, advanced scene logic (pleg-like), etc.
I bought imperihome because that’s my favorite mobile app, and considered buying the kodi plugin, but instead implemented the play/pause notification feature (only one I needed) through the json api instead.
All my lights, garage doors, fireplace, etc just work as is.[/quote]
I mis spoke on the 400 in plugins. that was plugins and hardware…
250 - HS3
261 - plugins
is $511
then add hardware cost.
it would be “roughly” $600
In any event, over the last few years, like most I’ve added much to my vera install… almost the whole house is connected. so it’s a fairly involved install at this point. it’s certainly not perfect. but it does work as expected most of the time.
[quote=“John M., post:2, topic:195573”]Hi fuzzysb,
Sorry to see you leaving.
If it’s something we can do to change your mind, or if you decide to come back, don’t hesitate to let us know.[/quote]
Let’s count the ways you could change users’ minds…
*Start doing soak tests. Release new firmware to 10% of the user base after QA is complete, wait a week, and see what bugs appear.
*Do QA.
*Stop making the UI less functional for prettier layouts. Pretty took away my thermostat’s heat/cool set point. Friday it was 80F and then 30F on Saturday. A single set point don’t cut it.
*Scene editing should be fast. There are no device updates to refresh. That should be the one place that flies. The pretty makes things slow.
*Luup scripts are core functionality; broken support for common operators is totally unacceptable. My firmware is 5 versions behind because it works and I can live without the new features.
*Why am I going to trust you with Alexa when your security model only keeps people from viewing logs and energy? They can unlock my house if they get on my wifi but God forbid they see my electricity usage.
*Why is your security model cloud based when this is a self-contained unit?
*Why do I need cloud authentication to read logs on a USB drive?
*Find the top 10 most popular devices (zwave, wifi, Zigbee, Bluetooth) that vera doesn’t support and fix that. I really have trouble believing that manufacturers aren’t willing to provide you their command APIs so they can sell more stuff.
*Repeat the above at least quarterly.
So I left Vera in May of 2015 to go to homeseer and haven’t looked back. I think Vera has its place, but it wasn’t in my house. Yes it is relatively expensive and yes plugins can cost money.
Some thoughts:
Don’t buy the pro version.
Consider buying the non pi version (windows/Linux) and then running that on a pi if you want. This way if you want to move to a different platform, you can. The pi license is only good on pis. There is information on this on the forums.
Plugins do cost but I found I didn’t need all the ones I had in my Vera. For instance I had my nest in my Vera, but for the first 1.5 years of being on homeseer I didn’t. I just didn’t need that automated for the most art (I work from home so the normal nest scheduler works great for me). When I did need it. I got the plugin.
Look for the free alternatives to plugins. Some, like the hue, have multiple paid versions and free ones. Especially look up jon00s plugins.
Look into the z-net z-wave interface. Holy cow! My Vera (with the antenna mod) would constantly miss messages. With the z-net most of my devices talk directly to it and there are no missed messages. Even my locks work great! And you can get and run multiple interfaces (USB, z-net, etc)
Wait until May or November to buy. They do 50% off software then.
And about the paid plugins. Yes they cost, but note that by far these are user created and supported plugins. That means that the bulk of the money goes to the developer (I think HS takes 30%). So you are supporting a fellow user when you pay for it.
Utilize the free 30day trial. For the main software and before you buy a plugin. It really helps you know what you’re getting into.
Finally some observations:
I don’t have to restart anything after every little change. Homeseer runs for months without restarts and small changes take affect instantly.
There is a learning curve to using homeseer. There event engine is different than the Vera but once you get used to it, it’s very powerful.
I think that’s it. Vera was a great starting point for me, but I outgrew it fast and that was without a lot of devices/logic.
Sent from my XT1585 using Tapatalk
[quote=“SirMeili, post:32, topic:195573”]So I left Vera in May of 2015 to go to homeseer and haven’t looked back. I think Vera has its place, but it wasn’t in my house. Yes it is relatively expensive and yes plugins can cost money.
Some thoughts:
Don’t buy the pro version.
Consider buying the non pi version (windows/Linux) and then running that on a pi if you want. This way if you want to move to a different platform, you can. The pi license is only good on pis. There is information on this on the forums.
Plugins do cost but I found I didn’t need all the ones I had in my Vera. For instance I had my nest in my Vera, but for the first 1.5 years of being on homeseer I didn’t. I just didn’t need that automated for the most art (I work from home so the normal nest scheduler works great for me). When I did need it. I got the plugin.
Look for the free alternatives to plugins. Some, like the hue, have multiple paid versions and free ones. Especially look up jon00s plugins.
Look into the z-net z-wave interface. Holy cow! My Vera (with the antenna mod) would constantly miss messages. With the z-net most of my devices talk directly to it and there are no missed messages. Even my locks work great! And you can get and run multiple interfaces (USB, z-net, etc)
Wait until May or November to buy. They do 50% off software then.
And about the paid plugins. Yes they cost, but note that by far these are user created and supported plugins. That means that the bulk of the money goes to the developer (I think HS takes 30%). So you are supporting a fellow user when you pay for it.
Utilize the free 30day trial. For the main software and before you buy a plugin. It really helps you know what you’re getting into.
Finally some observations:
I don’t have to restart anything after every little change. Homeseer runs for months without restarts and small changes take affect instantly.
There is a learning curve to using homeseer. There event engine is different than the Vera but once you get used to it, it’s very powerful.
I think that’s it. Vera was a great starting point for me, but I outgrew it fast and that was without a lot of devices/logic.
Sent from my XT1585 using Tapatalk[/quote]
Well said I forgot when I left to HomeSeer (a little over a year I’m guessing) and you pretty much said all that I could have. I also recommend a non pro version of full HS3. I also tested Pi and altho it works better then VERA I’m a windows person and it was alot easier and powerful to run it on a mini pc.
[quote=“Zoro, post:21, topic:195573”][quote=“John M., post:2, topic:195573”]Hi fuzzysb,
Sorry to see you leaving.
If it’s something we can do to change your mind, or if you decide to come back, don’t hesitate to let us know.[/quote]
@John M.
Hope you have read all of the posts in the thread… The comments on this forum have been pretty much consistent for quite some time. Many of us are still on UI5 and plan to stay there until the stability problems are fixed.
Z[/quote]
Hey Guys,
I’m not here just to annoy you, so please don’t bash me. I have a pretty complex setup of devices at home as well, and I often encounter the same hiccups. Some things I even sort out with information from here, on the forums, so we all understand the importance of this community.
I can re-assure you that every constructive feedback from here, will be seen by our R&D in one form or another.This is pretty much my job here.I gather feedback, and give a hand on the spot with things that stand in my hand to do so.
I wish as well, everything to be perfect starting from tomorrow, but the there are a lot of things going on in the background, that make things harder than we’d like. But this doesn’t mean we will ever slow down our paces or give up.We see it just another challenge to conquer. Our team has grown tenfold in the last two years and will continue to grow.
I don’t run a real intricate setup but so far it’s been pretty stable for me apart from some hiccups with firmware updates on my Vera 3 running out of room. I probably have more Vera’s then most as I run a dual non bridged unit setup that uses http calls to cooperate with each other as to spread the load. I have enough mains devices and both Vera 3’s have the antenna mod so the mesh is pretty well covered. Apart from those I have an Edge and a Plus that are intended to replace the duo of Vera 3’s to take advantage of Zwave+ and the faster CPU and more memory.
That migration is not going as fast as I had planned as I want to make sure to have a stable UI7 firmware before I make the jump. The Alexa integration is a plus for me so I’m waiting for that to come out of beta (both FW and integration) before starting. I’m looking at a weekend as I plan to start from scratch rather then do a backup & restore. With 4 Vera’s in the house, each with it’s own mesh, I’m pleasantly surprised by them getting along and not interfering with each other.
heads up from the Vera team is appreciated in these forums. I for one don’t have a Facebook or twitter account so whatever your team posts there I am oblivious to. 8)
On the Alexa front, there have been several requests for a dedicated Alexa sub forum. Any chance you can put in a good word for that?
Thank you for the good words BOFH,
Connected Objects board is live : http://forum.micasaverde.com/index.php/board,84.0.html
Your problems are what many of us faced. You say you don’t have a intricate setup but yet have multiple vera’s running different tasks. Your not a novice user as you might think you are.
I had 6 vera’s for two houses at one point. Was upgrading every year (actually less at one point starting with lites, then edge, then the plus is when I threw in the towel on each house) due to lack of RAM and performance from a under powered hardware platform. People think switching to a competitor is expensive, but I think they forget to look at full scope of things. Vera even if it was only 99-149.99 each unit cost me alot more not to mention my time or frustration, just talking physical hardware.
[/quote]
The truth on this is ui7 has been out since mid 2014 officially and in beta before that. We are very close to 3 years of ui7 and waiting to get “stable”. If after 3 years its not there, well you can fill in your own assumptions.
Vera has its place and I still have a unit going that I monitor for a relative that got some of my old parts. Its a great community and I learned alot starting off here. I watched my mentors leave before me and never understood why until I did myself. I just waited way too long to realize cheap can be expensive and got cought up in thinking veras plugins and the versatility couldn’t be matched (I was wrong). It’s like that first ugly girlfriend you don’t want to let go of, and after you bagged the next one you look back thinking your an idiot for waiting so long for find better. Hope others don’t have to make the same mistake I did.
I’ve found this thread to be incredibly helpful…
For what it’s worth and in an attempt to be constructive, what truly pushes me to look for green pastures are:
[ol][li]by far the worst is when you can’t connect to your vera. You can’t even control your house when you’re away from it like when the vera app won’t connect because the vera stops responding. And it’s not until you get home and power cycle it that you regain control.[/li]
[li]second worse is when you execute an action in the vera app and it either doesn’t work at all (despite being connected), or there is some kind of wacky 5-10 second delay before it does what you told it to. e.g. execute a scene that turns a bunch of lights on and you’re standing there in your dark house and nothing happens. you walk around turning them on manually before going to power cycle the vera and then halfway through that everything turns on.[/li]
[li]third worst is how LUA wants to restart everytime i cough. If I add so much as a single new light to the system, It takes me 2 minutes per scene that i want to update regarding that light to teach each scene to turn it on or off because each time it restarts LUA. annoying…[/li]
[li]when geofencing doesn’t work reliably for ANY reason it is frustrating.[/li]
[li]to a lesser extent, the interface does have annoying things about it. The biggest is why there is only 1 set point for thermostats set to auto (and why this hasn’t changed in 2+ years?).'[/li]
[li]adding devices that are the #1 sold zwave device (e.g. light switch) on amazon and having to add it as a generic device while you thumb through a long list of devices wondering who even buys those gives off a bad impression. Worse yet if they don’t work and the “solution” is to edit some field manually.[/li][/ol]
so there you go… i think if these were resolved (at least 1-4) I wouldn’t be here typing any of this.
It’s a bit of a concern reading this when I just bought an edge and considering more. After reading this I will def look at homeseer. Thanks for the feedback
Princess, if you want a bet both ways, consider using a UZB stick rather than the built in radio. Then you can take your Z-Wave network with you if you decide to go.
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