im going to be changing out some of my switches in my wall with some Z-wave compatible ones…
i saw some require a neutral wire, is that the same thing as a ground? i know i have 3 wires at each of my switches, positive, negative and then im assuming the last wire is the grounding wire…will it function as a neutral wire?
ABSOLUTELY NOT! Although Ground and Neutral are connected together in your breaker box, DO NOT EVER use ground as a neutral. Separating ground from neutral is a very important part of providing electricity safely in your house.
Since various things are grounded in your house have metal exteriors like those steel appliance, toasters, etc. If the ground lead ever comes loose at the breaker box and you have connected ground and neutral what happens is that all of these metal surfaces are now ac potential to ground (anything connected to your copper plumbing, gas lines, etc.). Someone touching any of those appliances and ground at the same time can be fatally electrocuted.
DON’T DO IT. Use of ground/earths as current carrying conductors is a criminal offense in many parts of the world.
The switch is just a ‘switch leg drop’, so the power for the light comes in to the light box, and then there is a 2-wire drop down to the switch to turn the light on and off. In this situation, there was no need to send the neutral down (and sometimes ground) to the switch during the initial construction.
To remedy this solution, you will need to run a neutral and possibly a ground from the light fixture to the switch box.
I have not done this, but have thought about it as an alternative: If you have attic access to the fixture, it may be possible to install a z-wave fixture module like an Evolve LFM-20 (in a switch box with a cover plate) to remotely switch the light fixture on and off. The black leads to the wall switch become traveler wires to control the relay function.
I am not an electrician, so double-check with a qualified electrician before proceeding with my advice.
yeah its going to be tough to run actual nuetral wires since this is in an apartment…i might have to go with one of the switches that dont require neutral wires…is there a downside on those ones?
Switches that do not require neutrals are most likely dimmers. So you will need to use bulbs that are capable of dimming. Their are some leb bulbs that will work. But you may have to rely on incandescent bulbs. You might want to double check to see if you have neutral wires installed. They will be a white wire and most likely capped off.
ok i just popped one open, it has 2 black wires, 1 red wire, 2 grounding wires crimped together, and 2 white wires capped together…
You are good on that one.
if there are two black wires and one red wire on the switch it sounds like it is a 3 way switch. 2 switches controlling one light. both switches will need to be replaced if it is a 3 way, one zwave switch and one remote switch
yeah that one is a 3 way…so i would have to get something like the GE package with 1 normal switch and then the AUX switch…or am i allowed to use 2 normal switches and not an AUX switch so they look identical?
There are several options. For the GE you must use their AUX switch. You can also use Levition z-wave switches with their aux switch or if you can go on ebay and search for intermatic ca3000 (relay switch). There are 6 packs for 99 dollars once in awhile. They allow you to use your old switch as the aux.
yes the ge package will work. no you cannot use two zwave switches one has to be a aux. if you want them to look identical the leviton vizia rf+ line has matching remotes but they are much more expensive then the ge package.
yeah i only have 1 3-way switch so i might get the Leviton for that one and the GE switches for everything else…
If you can afford it. I would recommend the Leviton switches. They really are a better switch with a 5 year warranty. They also support instant status. So when the switch is manually triggered, it will tell Vera that the state of the device has changed and update the status.
the GE aux switch doesn’t look that much different then the zwave switch it is just missing the disconnect pull out at the bottom to kill power, I would not mix the leviton and GE switches personally because of how different they operate, the levitons turn on and off by just pushing the bottom of the switch and the GE work as a typical top=on, bottom=off, might get confusing.
Garrett is right the levitons are a better product, if you look around you’ll find alot of users having problems with the GE switches with less then a year of use
Oh ok got it! yeah i liked the GE switches cuz of that blue LED vs the green LED haha…
but yeah, i wil stick to one brand and probably go with Leviton
A cheat we use sometimes is to “cap on” the aux switch. Most of the home owners don’t care about the aux switch once they have it under control with vera.
Turb0,
Can u elaborate on that? What do u mean by “cap on”…i assume u mean wire it always on? Does that mean one can only witch it at one location?
Hvtopi,
I use the Intermatic ca600 for the first switch in the circuit and then can keep using the old switches for the others. Using the actual switches works, you just dont get instant updates when looking at the state of the switch via software. Hpwever, vera polls every 60 secs by default but u can change poll times if you want. Also most software allows a manual refresh which will force a poll. Honestly, if i change a light switch via software, rarely do i need to know immediately that it changed…usually i run a scene and then go do something else and later when i have a moment i will bring us the gui and verify the light is now in my desired state.
Two downsides with the Intermatic is that they are not manufactured anymore (I think company went belly up), and two, i dont think the devices have a long life…but the latter is just a hunch based on warmth of switch even when lights are off.
/Z/
Yes, we get the electrician to make the secondary switch always on. In effect making it useless/non functioning. But it does allow the home owner to install the dimmer/on off switch and control it via their ipad etc.
Not a perfect solution, but it does work.
There’s one Leviton on/off switch that doesn’t require a neutral: VRS05. It can be used with incandescent lighting only (for that reason). Sounds like you have a neutral, so you might go VRS15. Presumably due to the absence of a mechanical relay, the VRS05 is quiet (i.e. no click sound).
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