Kwikset - Manual Routing

Other Devices & Integrations Door Locks & Sensors
1

Hello, I have been reading up on manual routing. Today my Kwikset lock encountered problems. I thought it was the batteries so I replaced them. However, I purposely bought several receptacles and switches that supported security/command class because my lock is a decent distance away from the Vera unit. The lock wouldn’t update nor communicate for quite some time so here’s some details to help out.

These are the neighbors for the lock: 1,3,4,9,10,12,13,14,
This is the auto route: 9-82x,4-83x,13.4-91x,9.4-91x (my research says it went to the spare bedroom light, score of 82 and failed then the thermostat with a score of 83 and failed, then 13 which is command class and thermostat and then failed then the stand up light score of 91 and back to the spare bedroom light and the thermostat and failed.

So what is off in my configuration? I’ve only ever done automatic configuration.

What should I do to force it to the security enabled devices which are spread out perfectly to reach the Vera Lite?

Below is each device ID and labeled are the ones with scene/command class:
[DeviceNo / id] device names on Wed Apr 22 17:49:33 2015
[011 / 8] Front Door Lock
[039 / 11] Front Room Lamp (scene/command class)
[040 / 12] Patio Light (scene/command class)
[041 / 13] Stand Up Light (scene/command class)
[037 / 10] Outside Foyer Light (scene/command class)
[005 / 3] Living Room Light
[010 / 4] Thermostat
[050 / 251689597] Garage Door Opener
[052 / 14] Back Bathroom Door
[053 / 44334CDA746C] Front Window
[054 / 44334CDAB9E4] Front Door Cam

2

13.4 and 9.4 are going to node (13 then 4) and (9 then 4) these are not device numbers but Node numbers.

0 is direct
9-82x is really 0.9-82x So controller (0) to Node #9 then to the Lock. 82 is the score (lower better) and x is that it failed last try.

Your list of devices you gave us doesn’t even show the Node #'s that are considered neighbors.

How long has this lock been working fine for? Shouldn’t need a custom route if its been working fine for some time.

3

Hi, it does show the neighbors. I missed two of them when copying but here is the full list:

[DeviceNo / id] device names on Wed Apr 22 17:49:33 2015
[002 / 1] _Scene Controller
[036 / 9] Spare Bedroom Light
[011 / 8] Front Door Lock
[039 / 11] Front Room Lamp
[040 / 12] Patio Light
[041 / 13] Stand Up Light
[037 / 10] Outside Foyer Light
[005 / 3] Living Room Light
[010 / 4] Thermostat
[050 / 251689597] Garage Door Opener
[052 / 14] Back Bathroom Door
[053 / 44334CDA746C] Front Window
[054 / 44334CDAB9E4] Front Door Cam

So the only time it hit a security/command class device (and failed) was 13 which is the stand up light.

This happened today and I haven’t had problems except my initial install about a year ago but the purpose of ensuring I had devices that were capable of carrying the encryption lock signals reliably was to prevent this which is why I wanted to consider a manual route.

4

[quote=“tomtcom, post:3, topic:187023”]Hi, it does show the neighbors. I missed two of them when copying but here is the full list:

[DeviceNo / id] device names on Wed Apr 22 17:49:33 2015
[002 / 1] _Scene Controller
[036 / 9] Spare Bedroom Light
[011 / 8] Front Door Lock
[039 / 11] Front Room Lamp
[040 / 12] Patio Light
[041 / 13] Stand Up Light
[037 / 10] Outside Foyer Light
[005 / 3] Living Room Light
[010 / 4] Thermostat
[050 / 251689597] Garage Door Opener
[052 / 14] Back Bathroom Door
[053 / 44334CDA746C] Front Window
[054 / 44334CDAB9E4] Front Door Cam

So the only time it hit a security/command class device (and failed) was 13 which is the stand up light.

This happened today and I haven’t had problems except my initial install about a year ago but the purpose of ensuring I had devices that were capable of carrying the encryption lock signals reliably was to prevent this which is why I wanted to consider a manual route.[/quote]

It will only use routes with security command class. I would run a backup from a few days ago and retest. It’s been working for a year and now you have an issue. Seems suspect.

5

[quote=“integlikewhoa”][quote=“tomtcom, post:3, topic:187023”]Hi, it does show the neighbors. I missed two of them when copying but here is the full list:

[DeviceNo / id] device names on Wed Apr 22 17:49:33 2015
[002 / 1] _Scene Controller
[036 / 9] Spare Bedroom Light
[011 / 8] Front Door Lock
[039 / 11] Front Room Lamp
[040 / 12] Patio Light
[041 / 13] Stand Up Light
[037 / 10] Outside Foyer Light
[005 / 3] Living Room Light
[010 / 4] Thermostat
[050 / 251689597] Garage Door Opener
[052 / 14] Back Bathroom Door
[053 / 44334CDA746C] Front Window
[054 / 44334CDAB9E4] Front Door Cam

So the only time it hit a security/command class device (and failed) was 13 which is the stand up light.

This happened today and I haven’t had problems except my initial install about a year ago but the purpose of ensuring I had devices that were capable of carrying the encryption lock signals reliably was to prevent this which is why I wanted to consider a manual route.[/quote]

It will only use routes with security command class. I would run a backup from a few days ago and retest. It’s been working for a year and now you have an issue. Seems suspect.[/quote]
Ok and I would have assumed the same however only 1 device in the route had the security class. None of the others do. And there’s 4 devices in my network that have security class.

6

[quote=“tomtcom, post:5, topic:187023”][quote=“integlikewhoa”][quote=“tomtcom, post:3, topic:187023”]Hi, it does show the neighbors. I missed two of them when copying but here is the full list:

[DeviceNo / id] device names on Wed Apr 22 17:49:33 2015
[002 / 1] _Scene Controller
[036 / 9] Spare Bedroom Light
[011 / 8] Front Door Lock
[039 / 11] Front Room Lamp
[040 / 12] Patio Light
[041 / 13] Stand Up Light
[037 / 10] Outside Foyer Light
[005 / 3] Living Room Light
[010 / 4] Thermostat
[050 / 251689597] Garage Door Opener
[052 / 14] Back Bathroom Door
[053 / 44334CDA746C] Front Window
[054 / 44334CDAB9E4] Front Door Cam

So the only time it hit a security/command class device (and failed) was 13 which is the stand up light.

This happened today and I haven’t had problems except my initial install about a year ago but the purpose of ensuring I had devices that were capable of carrying the encryption lock signals reliably was to prevent this which is why I wanted to consider a manual route.[/quote]

It will only use routes with security command class. I would run a backup from a few days ago and retest. It’s been working for a year and now you have an issue. Seems suspect.[/quote]
Ok and I would have assumed the same however only 1 device in the route had the security class. None of the others do. And there’s 4 devices in my network that have security class.[/quote]

Those routes all failed! Judging by that is not a good base. Run a backup first and see how it works, then you can check the route if the lock is working.

Also not all “Command Classes” are the same you could get more in depth of what your lock requires (older or newer lock) and what each of those switches can use. But I wouldn’t even go there until its back up and working.

7

[quote=“integlikewhoa”][quote=“tomtcom, post:5, topic:187023”][quote=“integlikewhoa”][quote=“tomtcom, post:3, topic:187023”]Hi, it does show the neighbors. I missed two of them when copying but here is the full list:

[DeviceNo / id] device names on Wed Apr 22 17:49:33 2015
[002 / 1] _Scene Controller
[036 / 9] Spare Bedroom Light
[011 / 8] Front Door Lock
[039 / 11] Front Room Lamp
[040 / 12] Patio Light
[041 / 13] Stand Up Light
[037 / 10] Outside Foyer Light
[005 / 3] Living Room Light
[010 / 4] Thermostat
[050 / 251689597] Garage Door Opener
[052 / 14] Back Bathroom Door
[053 / 44334CDA746C] Front Window
[054 / 44334CDAB9E4] Front Door Cam

So the only time it hit a security/command class device (and failed) was 13 which is the stand up light.

This happened today and I haven’t had problems except my initial install about a year ago but the purpose of ensuring I had devices that were capable of carrying the encryption lock signals reliably was to prevent this which is why I wanted to consider a manual route.[/quote]

It will only use routes with security command class. I would run a backup from a few days ago and retest. It’s been working for a year and now you have an issue. Seems suspect.[/quote]
Ok and I would have assumed the same however only 1 device in the route had the security class. None of the others do. And there’s 4 devices in my network that have security class.[/quote]

Those routes all failed! Judging by that is not a good base. Run a backup first and see how it works, then you can check the route if the lock is working.

Also not all “Command Classes” are the same you could get more in depth of what your lock requires (older or newer lock) and what each of those switches can use. But I wouldn’t even go there until its back up and working.[/quote]
Understood again but only 1 device in the route had the security. The rest were not any of those security devices.

I’ll check the lock capabilities against the capabilities of the security devices to be sure.

8

What you really need is actually called “BEAMING” And I think alot of devices within the last year or 2 support it. Even the 30.00 GE switches support it if they are a newer revision.

You might find out more devices then what you think actually support it.

9

[quote=“tomtcom, post:7, topic:187023”]Understood again but only 1 device in the route had the security. The rest were not any of those security devices.

I’ll check the lock capabilities against the capabilities of the security devices to be sure.[/quote]

That route is obviously not working and who knows when it was last changed and why (well you can check when the last route was updated). So saying that that route is not correct seems to be a given at this point. You need to go back to the last known good route and recheck then.

Also what types of devices are those in your list? Do they support beaming?

I think you can check for a “B” in the capabilities of the devices in question if I remember right.

10

[quote=“integlikewhoa, post:9, topic:187023”][quote=“tomtcom, post:7, topic:187023”]Understood again but only 1 device in the route had the security. The rest were not any of those security devices.

I’ll check the lock capabilities against the capabilities of the security devices to be sure.[/quote]

That route is obviously not working and who knows when it was last changed and why (well you can check when the last route was updated). So saying that that route is not correct seems to be a given at this point. You need to go back to the last known good route and recheck then.

Also what types of devices are those in your list? Do they support beaming?

I think you can check for a “B” in the capabilities of the devices in question if I remember right.[/quote]

Ok thanks for all the answers. The 4 devices are 2 receptacles and 2 light switches and they both are B capable. Below are the device capabilities. I’ll do some more research and check a few more avenues.

Linear WO15Z-1 211,156,0,4,16,3,L,R,B,RS,|37,39,43,44,112,114,115,117,134,

Linea WS15Z-1 211,156,0,4,16,3,L,R,B,RS,|37,39,43,44,112,114,115,134,

11

[quote=“tomtcom”][quote=“integlikewhoa, post:9, topic:187023”][quote=“tomtcom, post:7, topic:187023”]Understood again but only 1 device in the route had the security. The rest were not any of those security devices.

I’ll check the lock capabilities against the capabilities of the security devices to be sure.[/quote]

That route is obviously not working and who knows when it was last changed and why (well you can check when the last route was updated). So saying that that route is not correct seems to be a given at this point. You need to go back to the last known good route and recheck then.

Also what types of devices are those in your list? Do they support beaming?

I think you can check for a “B” in the capabilities of the devices in question if I remember right.[/quote]

Ok thanks for all the answers. The 4 devices are 2 receptacles and 2 light switches and they both are B capable. Below are the device capabilities. I’ll do some more research and check a few more avenues.

Linear WO15Z-1 211,156,0,4,16,3,L,R,B,RS,|37,39,43,44,112,114,115,117,134,

Linea WS15Z-1 211,156,0,4,16,3,L,R,B,RS,|37,39,43,44,112,114,115,134,[/quote]
I think I found the issue. More classes are supported from the thermostat versus the receptacles and switch so that is a stronger route than the linear. Dam, thought I did all my research when I bought them.

12

Really beaming is what you need and I think you have alot more devices that support beaming then what you think you do. Altho your learning this is not fixing your problem. And a Manual route should not be required. Also a lock that worked for a year and then one day stopped seems like something got changed or broke.

Roll back a day or two and retest. You may have a bad lock or some z-wave update/configure might have broken your lock setup.

13

Really beaming is what you need and I think you have alot more devices that support beaming then what you think you do. Altho your learning this is not fixing your problem. And a Manual route should not be required. Also a lock that worked for a year and then one day stopped seems like something got changed or broke.

Roll back a day or two and retest. You may have a bad lock or some z-wave update/configure might have broken your lock setup.[/quote]
Ok, I see your points. Thanks for the info! I’ll check on that.