[quote=“Grwebster, post:20, topic:182769”]And nice to automate it so you can stop trying to remember to do it😀. I would think the away mode would be good for shutting it off, but you would have to have a inbound to pre-warm. Just wondering if anything will grow in there while it is sitting there cool for months. Might want to flush it when you arrive anyway.
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It is all geofenced automation. House is in AZ not many cool months.
Yes, this is exactly what I want to do. Simply a means to cut the power off to the immersion heater. The thermostat is on the immersion heater so will function as normal.
The reason I want it is that the immersion heater is for a loft comversion bathroom that is not on the main central heating / hot water circuit. Most of the time the room isn’t used, but when guests come I want to switch it on and then off again when they leave. I could easily forget unless it is on my z wave network
There seems to be no particularly easy way to do this (in the UK - where the CA3750 isn’t available).
My preferred solution now is to use a simple z-wave switch, connected to a relay. For the relay I was considering this: http://www.amazon.co.uk/Single-Phase-90-250V-Solid-Module/dp/B00HR84JQO/
The only problem is that that relay is single pole (ie only switches the live). In the UK the regulations state that I need to switch both the live and the neutral. Is that important? Or could I just leave the existing manual isolator (double pole) also wired in in case I ever need to totally isolate it? What’s the worst that could happen (serious question)?
Have you searched for double pole realy? You shouldn’t have a problem finding that then adding zwave like you planned to it.
Yes I have searched. In the UK I can’t find one. Amazing. But true.
I need it to be 20A minimum (ideally 30A).
I suppose I could just use 2 single pole relays, controlled by the same z wave switch
Yes I have searched. In the UK I can’t find one. Amazing. But true.
I need it to be 20A minimum (ideally 30A).
I suppose I could just use 2 single pole relays, controlled by the same z wave switch[/quote]
Well if thats the case you have your brother heading over you shouldn’t limit yourself then.
Also here’s another option, to use a non z-wave switch and make it z-wave. You can ignore the Arduino side and use z-wave instead.
http://forum.micasaverde.com/index.php/topic,26988.msg192282.html#msg192282
My pool equipment (pump, lights, jets) uses these inside the panel to switch them on. They are 24v input and dual contacts on the out side. I used this 10.00 generic to place a bad factory one.
Here is the official one:
http://www.amazon.com/Jandy-Relay-Harness-Aqualink-Control/dp/B0039Q9UWG/ref=pd_sim_indust_1?ie=UTF8&refRID=027JJ741RHXY1TDZJDG4
They are rated for 3HP 240v motors.
Bottom line there is a ton of options, and you can ship to UK or have your brother bring it. The links I posted get delived here in the US as soon as next day 2 days for PRIME customers like myself. That pool relay is only 2 inch in size and fits in my pocket easy for him to bring. Wire it up to 24v wall wort for sprinklers or something.
Yes I have searched. In the UK I can't find one. Amazing. But true.
Try searching for a contactor rather than a relay. There are many 30A contactors available in the UK. You can get two pole ones or use two of the three poles on a three-phase model.
E.G.
http://www.tlc-direct.co.uk/Products/HGESC225.html
http://cpc.farnell.com/1/3/contactor-30a
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/ABB-CONTACTOR-A26-30-10-220-230V-50Hz-230-240V-60Hz-11KW-30A-/281140117866?pt=UK_BOI_Electrical_Components_Supplies_ET&hash=item417541c16a
http://www.amazon.co.uk/3TB43-Pole-Contactor-Motor-Control/dp/B00LXCTEWO/ref=sr_1_30?ie=UTF8&qid=1410994688&sr=8-30&keywords=contactor+30a
Having checked my Immersion heater it is rated at 3kW only (I assumed it would be more).
There is a Fibaro relay rated at 3kW ([url=http://www.vesternet.com/z-wave-fibaro-relay-insert-1-3kw]http://www.vesternet.com/z-wave-fibaro-relay-insert-1-3kw[/url])
Do you think this will be OK, or is that too close to the limit?
[quote=“dominoman, post:27, topic:182769”]Having checked my Immersion heater it is rated at 3kW only (I assumed it would be more).
There is a Fibaro relay rated at 3kW ([url=http://www.vesternet.com/z-wave-fibaro-relay-insert-1-3kw]http://www.vesternet.com/z-wave-fibaro-relay-insert-1-3kw[/url])
Do you think this will be OK, or is that too close to the limit?[/quote]
While it is good design to have some safety factor, it should be OK. You should feed it from a double-pole-switched, fused spur with a 13A fuse.
NEC does not require a switch to break both lines to the heater. There must be a disconnect that breaks both lines but the control element can just break one line.
2 pole contacts are very common and cheap though. Every AC unit has a 20-40A dual pole contactor. Less than $20… Then just use a standard ZWave device to control the contactor coil. Put a 24vac transfer in between (most AC contactors are 24vac coil).
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@curiousB - Since he’s in the U.K. his rules are different than NEC.
Yes I have searched. In the UK I can’t find one. Amazing. But true.
I need it to be 20A minimum (ideally 30A).
I suppose I could just use 2 single pole relays, controlled by the same z wave switch[/quote]
Well if thats the case you have your brother heading over you shouldn’t limit yourself then.
Also here’s another option, to use a non z-wave switch and make it z-wave. You can ignore the Arduino side and use z-wave instead.
http://forum.micasaverde.com/index.php/topic,26988.msg192282.html#msg192282[/quote]
Just to clarify. The solution is not really a “Z-Wave” solution, it’s a Arduino solution, utilizing the MySensors.org framework and the NRF24 Radio (2.4ghz). The solution I manage to build can also relay temp. back to Vera (Used for various non-critical functions)
[quote=“dominoman, post:27, topic:182769”]Having checked my Immersion heater it is rated at 3kW only (I assumed it would be more).
There is a Fibaro relay rated at 3kW ([url=http://www.vesternet.com/z-wave-fibaro-relay-insert-1-3kw]http://www.vesternet.com/z-wave-fibaro-relay-insert-1-3kw[/url])
Do you think this will be OK, or is that too close to the limit?[/quote]
If you did manage to connect it up (those contact points look pretty small), I don’t think it would last very long, as you are right at the top of it’s working limit. Now you might be able to find a 230v(coil) 30a contactor to unload the Fibaro. (use the Fibaro to activate the contactor which would carry the heater load)
I’m going to try it with the Fibaro relay on it’s own, putting it behind the existing double pole isolator as suggested. That way I can totally isolate the immersion heater with the switch if I am ever doing anything on it - but day to day use the z wave relay.
As for it being at it’s limit… I’m going to give it a go and see what happens. I’m guessing (hoping) that if they rate it at 3kw there is a little margin of error built in there anyway… If not, well it will be being returned for a replacement and I’ll then try using it in conjunction with a 30A relay / contactor.
I’ll let you know how I get on.
I am looking to do the same thing. Using the same equipment how did you get on with it
update:
I found a aeon heavy duty relay rated for 40 amp 9.6 kw and is doutlets pole switch it 91pounds sterling from vested net
Don’t know if it works with vera yet
I’m from uk
hope this helps
In the end I just used the Fibaro relay on it’s own. So far it is holding up well. It’s been in a couple of months and has been totally reliable, switching the immersion heater on for an hour every morning on weekdays.
Does the Fibaro get hot at all?
Just a word of caution to anyone else who tries this (I do not believe the Fibaro has this capabililty): If the Zwave switch has “autosensing” capabilities (where the switch energizes if someone turns on the device that is plugged into it), then a heater with a mechanical thermostat can cause a problem.
When the day is on the warmer side, the mechanical thermostat can open and close by itself (even with no power). When it closes, the zwave switch detects it, and now you have a unattended heater running.
To be honest I have left it well alone since I fitted it. But I will check.
Hi
I’ve bought a Fibaro 3KW insert relay for use with my immersion heater. However I was a bit concerned that it might be at the upper limit so I also bought this Solid State Relay, which was suggested by a Sparky I know.
Single Phase Solid State Relay SSR-40AA 40A 150-350V 24-480VAC w Heat Sink
Currently there is a wall switch in the kitchen for turning on or off the immersion heater. Looking behind this switch there are two live, two neutral and two earth cables.
So presumably live feed coming into the switch and then out of the switch then going upstairs to the airing cupboard where the hot water cylinder tank is.
In the airing cupboard is another On/Off wall switch, which is normally always left in the On position. Behind this switch coming from the wall, are just three cables, live, neutral and earth. Then there is a flex cable also coming out of this switch to the top of the tank / immersion heater.
I am unsure how or where to wire in the fibaro 3KW relay and the Solid State Relay.
Only the Fibaro insert relay would fit behind the wall switch in the kitchen.
Or if I put both relays in the airing cupboard upstairs? I think I’d have to just leave the switch in the kitchen permanently in the On position?
Any wiring tips and advise would be very handy!
Thanks.
You should really put the SSR in an enclosure to avoid accidental contact with the live parts. It will probably need ventilation holes/louvres to stop it overheating. You may as well put the Fibaro module in there with it.
Your kitchen switch sounds like a double-pole isolator. That is a good thing to have in the feed. As you say, you would normally leave it turned on unless you needed to shut it down for some reason.
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